Re: [independence-1] Platform convention

Terry,

?

The differences you speak of in #2 are not that dissimilar from a vetting process of a political party.? I don't believe you are starting a Pac, but the money aspect of it does kind of sound like one.? Maybe a different way of stating your intent for $8 per person?

?

I won't speak to what organization does what, since most get started for the best of reasons and then change.? By the way, what would make the AVA different this way?? Would you always maintain control of the AVA?

?

I hope you can get 5 million people in your group, I'd like to see it done.? Good luck.

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Terry, I don't see where Phil attacked you.? Where did he smear you?? Are you taking the constructive critisim you espoused as liking and turning it into attacks on yourself?? If the idea does resonate with enough people, I don't think you'll have to worry about too much publicity until you can galvanize 5 million people into doing something all at once.?

?

Again, good luck to you Terry, I think you'll need it.

?

Doug Brown

----- Original Message ----
From: Terrance Bushard <[address removed]>
To: [address removed]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 1:15:25 AM
Subject: Re: [independence-1] Platform convention

Phil,

2) No. Political parties exist to assist in the election of their candidates for political office. The AVA plan is to organize the general public for the purpose of imposing an obligation upon all U. S. Senators and Representatives, to account to us, on a continual and timely basis, for their financial management of our federal government. We would do this through a monthly interview process as outlined on my web site. Notice, we would also be interviewing all viable candidates for these offices 3 times prior to an election. The difference should be quite clear to all.

3) No, and I am not proposing a new PAC. I am proposing we organize for the the above purpose.

4) No organization exists today, nor to my knowledge, has ever existed for the stated purpose.?

5) I honestly believe there are at least 5,000,000 people in this country who want financially accountable politics. Whether I can get the job done remains to be seen.?

6) Are we practicing the politics of personal destruction here? Smear me all you want. ?I DON'T CARE! Notice the capital letters for emphasis. If, as I expect, the message resonates with enough people, it will begin to generate its' own momentum. When that happens, rest assured much publicity will be sought out and had. Furthermore, I think it is safe to assume the FBI and Homeland Security may take a strong interest in me and the AVA, if we get close to the magic number.

Posit all you want. If you had gone through the entire web site, you would have noticed that nowhere is anyone asked about their political affiliation.?

Terry

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On Jan 29, 2008, at 3:07 PM, phil fuehrer wrote:

Terry:

My thoughts on your idea/initiative -?

1) It's great that you're passionate about something

and 'working it' to try and implement but,

2) Isn't what you want the stuff that political

parties are about - or the IP is/could be about -

thereby rendering your group either meaningless (or

less meaningful) by itself or simply a sub group of

something larger?

3) Isn't what you propose a function and

responsibility of the electorate and elections??

Voters don't like their officials spending money they

don't vote them back in to office - no need for a

PAC-like group to be supplanted into the mix,

4) Isn't your effort a duplicate of organizations that

already exist (i.e.- The Concord Coalition, Citizens

for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington, et al)??

5) Do you honestly believe you're going to get flocks

of people in and form this uber group of 5 million??

The more than century-old NRA (with much more

energizing issues - even if they can be polarizing)

has only about 4 million members by comparison. This

lends credibility questions to your effort (as in,

"This guy's not credible. I'm moving on.")

5) If people believe 2, 3 and 4 above (as I do) why

commit to giving your group $8 per year? In the scheme

of the world you're an entire unknown (as in - "who's

this guy?"). That doesn't inspire people to give you

money every year for dues but, rather, smacks of

several emails I get everyday from barristers, bankers

and dethroned government officials from African

countries offering to "share" their pilfered wealth

with me if only I get in contact with them.?

You may end up with some supporters outside of

Minnesota, but I'd posit that the members you may have

been able to gather to date are MNIP members

sympathetic to the cause and to a fellow-IPer's

efforts.? Keep on keeping on, but realize why not

every "great idea" that one generates is viewed as

highly by anyone else.? And, if you don't think

someone is pulling their weight in a position put your

name in the ring to take over.

Respectfully,?

Phil Fuehrer

--- Terrance Bushard <[address removed]>

wrote:

Peter,

You certainly are confused. You say the choice is

between giving up ?

on the country or doing something. If the

"something" you do is the ?

wrong thing, what's the difference?

We have an accountability problem in this country

and the IP's, and ?

your response, is to have a party! Good grief!

You have 2 choices.

You can either choose to be part of the solution to

the ?

accountability problem by organizing for that

purpose, or you can ?

choose to be part of the accountability problem by

failing to do so.

Your actions to date tell me you choose to be part

of the ?

accountability problem! Hopefully, that is because

you have a hearing ?

problem, as in you choose not to hear.

One last time. I have a solution to the

accountability problem. It is ?

simple, affordable and fool proof. Here it is.

http://www.americanvotersassociation.com

Respectfully

Terry Bushard

[address removed]

On Jan 28, 2008, at 9:57 PM, Peter Tharaldson wrote:

Tim-

I am confused. The process we devised in 2005

worked well. We ?

considered planks and changes one by one. The

member that spoke was ?

speaking against any additions to the platform.

One of the things that changed was to establish a

base platform and ?

then consider changes...that allows for a greater

hearing of any ?

changes...and in fact, unlike most platform

conventions, we did get ?

through every proposed change. About 1/2 of the

additions were ?

made, 1/2 failed.

Let's reintroduce your proposals on May 3rd. This

time I think ?

considering them as divided proposals would work

well. I understand ?

that they are all related to efficiencies from

technology ?

improvement, but that is a lot of wording to

digest and it would be ?

easier to handle them one by one.

The Platform gets another shot on May 3rd per the

call of the ?

convention. Try it again...I would be happy to

help divide them in ?

a stategic manner that would probably sell better.

Peter

As for not coming to the convention...it is always

worth it. The ?

choice is between giving up on the country and the

state or doing ?

something. We did a lot on Saturday....and maybe

that was the ?

problem...but people were excited.

Tim Nelson <[address removed]> wrote:

I hope I never see a repeat of the behavior of a

few of the "movers ?

and shakers" at the morning session of the

platform convention. If ?

trying to prevent the motions for platform changes

were not enough, ?

the grandstanding to testify against every change

by one member ?

really took the cake.

Are you adults? Did you not know that a platform

convention just ?

might get involved with the platform?

I considered leaving before my platform change

came up. I felt that ?

I didn't belong in that room, or in the party.

When my turn came, ?

my heart wasn't in it.

On a personal note, since my political viewpoint

is so wrapped ?

around the downsizing of the public sector through

new technology, ?

and the party is not, perhaps it would be for the

best if I find ?

myself a seat outside the party.

It has been nice to meet, and talk to many of you,

especially ?

Peter, Jack Uldrich, Peter Hutchinson, Red and the

meetup groups.

Tim Nelson

Golden Valley

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