Re: [independence-1] Platform convention

Terry:

No smearing meant at all - just what I see to be

possible reservations or qualms of the "regular

citizen" that might run across your group.

But let me try to clarify my points:? I know who you

are (at least a little) - but for some schlep in

Alaska (ie.- elsewhere than MN or even here if they

have no idea who you are) you're not only a complete

unknown, you're a complete unknown asking for $8/yr

for some esoteric, ethereal or ephemeral-like good

government group.? The guy in Alaska is as likely to

think "scam" (probably more likely) than to think "oh,

that's a great idea. I'll sign up".

As for the other ideas - I still see very little (if

any) practical difference between the AVA, a political

party or a PAC (or what these organizations could be

pushed to accomplish).? You want accountability and

will interview candidates/officials, but so what? I'll

interview with you (hypothetically) tell you one thing

and do another. What are you going to do about it?

Tattle on me?? The answer is vote me out (or try to,

or shame me, etc.) - and that's the same thing that

parties, PACs and other special interest groups work

to do.?

And, ultimately it comes down to politics and ideology

anyway - your pork barrell project is, for me,

integral to solving some hugely important issue. You

need to have a balanced budget and no debt, I don't

care if there is deficit spending as long as the

deficit rises more slowly than the rate of economic

growth and may even think that's better fo us than a

balance budget.? These are all just simple examples,

but show that holding officials "accountable" is not

so easy as saying it.?

I'm not saying don't pursue your goals - I'm only

saying that if you're frustrated that it isn't

catching on like a wildfire it may be that others may

not see the problem you do or may believe that other

groups, ways, or strategies are better ways to get to

the solutions. Frankly, that's the reason you don't

have my name on your comittment list - I'd rather the

IP serve the role (or similar role) that the AVA

proposes.

Phil

--- Terrance Bushard <[address removed]>

wrote:

? Doug,

Communication is easy in the sense that we all know

one or more of ?

the world's languages. However, despite a great

amount of redundancy, ?

there is a high probability of ambiguity and

misinterpretation in any ?

communication process. As in, messages sent?

commonly are not ?

messages received. Which is yet another way of

saying that effective ?

communication is difficult and it is very

frustrating when messages ?

sent are not messages received.

Perhaps Phil wasn't smearing me, but that is the

message I received ?

by the wording of his questions. Phil, if I

misinterpreted your ?

message, I apologize. Perhaps, when Peter replied to

Tim's original ?

message yesterday, "The choice is between giving up

on the country ?

and the state or doing something.", I received the

message that the ?

leaving the IP was the equivalent of giving up on

our country and ?

state. If I misinterpreted the message, I apologize.

To the point of your e-mail.

The commonly used word, "vetting" is not in my

dictionary. I assume ?

it means some kind of screening process, as in

screening potential ?

candidates for political office for the purpose of

determining if the ?

"party" wants to endorse and support their

candidacy.

The current situation is that? U. S. Senators and

Representatives ?

have no obligation to account to the people for

their financial ?

management of our government, because "the people"

are not organized ?

for the purpose of imposing an obligation upon them

to do so. The AVA ?

is about imposing an obligation upon them to account

to us, on a ?

continual and timely basis, and in an organized

manner, through the ?

monthly interview process. I hope the difference is

clear.

PAC. Political Action Committee. I think it is a

group of people ?

organized for the purpose of promoting a certain

political action. ?

They form a committee, screen politicians and

support politicians who ?

will promote their preferred political action. Often

times, with ?

financial support. AVA members are organized for the

purpose of ?

getting answers and explanations about the financial

management of ?

our government, not to give money to politicians. I

hope that is clear.

The $8.00 per person is to finance the mission of

the AVA. BTW "they" ?

have already put over $30,000.00 on every Americans

credit card, ?

"they" are spending at a rate which will put an

additional $1,750.00 ?

or so, on every one's credit cards this year, and

that is before they ?

put the "stimulus package" on our credit cards.

$8.00 is as close to ?

free as I can make it, and still envision making it

happen. I hope ?

that is clear.

Mission creep? I can't imagine any reason to change

the mission. ?

Furthermore, I think there would be serious legal

ramifications for ?

doing so.

Would I maintain control of the AVA? I've tried to

get Ross Perot to ?

take it, but I can't get through his gate keepers. I

have no idea if ?

he would even be interested. I've tried to hand it

to Citizens ?

Against Government Waste, but can't break through

the gate keepers. I ?

don't think imposing an obligation to financially

account upon ?

politicians is in their mission statement anyway

I've talked to the ?

Concord Coalition. Same thing. So the answer is, at

least for the ?

foreseeable future, yes. Tomorrow, I will be 59

years old. There is ?

no one in this world I trust to do the job more than

I trust myself. ?

I will maintain control until such time as I find

someone I trust ?

enough to hand control over to.

Doug, I hope I have answered your questions. As you

say, "I'd like to ?

see it done." I hope to see your name on the sign up

list soon.

Thank you,

Terry Bushard

http://www.americanvotersassociation.com

On Jan 30, 2008, at 7:35 AM, Doug Brown wrote:

Terry,

The differences you speak of in #2 are not that

dissimilar from a ?

vetting process of a political party.? I don't

believe you are ?

starting a Pac, but the money aspect of it does

kind of sound like ?

one.? Maybe a different way of stating your intent

for $8 per person?

I won't speak to what organization does what,

since most get ?

started for the best of reasons and then change.?

By the way, what ?

would make the AVA different this way?? Would you

always maintain ?

control of the AVA?

I hope you can get 5 million people in your group,

I'd like to see ?

it done.? Good luck.

Terry, I don't see where Phil attacked you.? Where

did he smear ?

you?? Are you taking the constructive critisim you

espoused as ?

liking and turning it into attacks on yourself??

If the idea does ?

resonate with enough people, I don't think you'll

have to worry ?

about too much publicity until you can galvanize 5

million people ?

into doing something all at once.

Again, good luck to you Terry, I think you'll need

it.

Doug Brown

----- Original Message ----

From: Terrance Bushard

<[address removed]>

To: [address removed]

Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 1:15:25 AM

Subject: Re: [independence-1] Platform convention

Phil,

2) No. Political parties exist to assist in the

election of their ?

candidates for political office. The AVA plan is

to organize the ?

general public for the purpose of imposing an

obligation upon all ?

U. S. Senators and Representatives, to account to

us, on a ?

continual and timely basis, for their financial

management of our ?

federal government. We would do this through a

monthly interview ?

process as outlined on my web site. Notice, we

would also be ?

interviewing all viable candidates for these

offices 3 times prior ?

to an election. The difference should be quite

clear to all.

3) No, and I am not proposing a new PAC. I am

proposing we organize ?

for the the above purpose.

4) No organization exists today, nor to my

knowledge, has ever ?

existed for the stated purpose.

=== message truncated ===

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